Pure and utter BS, so sick and tired of this company. Not only do they do what they want they also control the news and papers.
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Posted 24 February 2014 - 03:55 PM
Response from Mr. Cumberland to Mr. Gilbert, JD Irving Biologist:
Dear John – I must say I was surprised that you and your company would publically attempt to discredit and slander a professional rather than confidently address the issue of herbicide use. Rather than assuming that we are on opposite sides of this issue I would have thought you would talk directly to me about my intent rather than guessing and inferring what it is. I think you would be very surprised that we are actually on the same page with what needs to occur in this ongoing debate.
I’d like to expand and encourage you on many of your points. However, to do this on a level playing field – in the spirit of cooperation that industry suggests is needed – I’d suggest a good indication of this cooperation would be to print our discussion in all the Irving-owned papers in New Brunswick. If my points are ludicrous and ill-founded, what a great chance to show the people of the province that this is true. Would you do this so we can have a truly open discussion about the issue?
First – let’s be clear on my intent. I in no way want to discredit professionals in the forest industry. My only intent is to discuss a product used by the industry and its effects on the growth of our forest and the wildlife that uses (or doesn’t use) it. Those concerned with the use of herbicide actually are attempting to help you create jobs. So to be clear – I am all for forestry – because harvesting trees CREATES good deer habitat. (but obviously there is a limit to harvest as deer require deer yards also). However, portraying herbicide as beneficial to deer when it kills hardwood trees is simply illogical. I have a professional obligation as a Certified Wildlife Biologist to speak to this issue I have studied and observed. To NOT do so would be irresponsible.
Next, calling upon research on this topic is a fantastic idea! I believe it has been far too long since anyone has looked CLOSELY at this. I’m convinced the public will be very interested in who actually funded much of the herbicide research and further, where it originates, what types of herbicide are tested and how it was done. While we’re looking at research, I will also bring to light the ALL the forestry-based research papers that clearly and emphatically prove that GLYPHOSATE herbicide is an amazingly effective herbicide that permanently removes hardwoods from plantations (look at Pollard and Erdle’s 2002 research from NB).
I suggest a public forum be called where we can discuss the wildlife research you say suggests herbicides are beneficial to deer. Gather it ALL up – every single peer-reviewed research paper on herbicides and wildlife. Then, with the media present we’ll take a real close look at it – ALL of it. To ensure we are comparing apples to apples, we will need to remove all the papers that look at herbicide other than glyphosate – you know – the ones like 2-4D, Tricloptor, and others that are no longer used – because they didn’t work. Then, we’ll take out all the studies done more than 1000 kilometer away from NB – because their forests are different and deer there eat different foods. Then, we can take out all the papers that only focus on moose, black-tailed deer, and all those that DON’T focus on white-tailed deer. Once we are able to compare apples to apples we’ll be left with only one paper – Justin Vreeland’s paper from Maine. One paper. Then we can take a closer look at this paper. However, you’ll be disappointed to see that this paper supports what I have found here in NB. If you don’t have the papers don’t worry – I have every single one and I TOTALLY agree the public should know EXACTLY what they purport.
We also both agree on your point that you should “show the ground” to the public of New Brunswick –not just the two or three hand-selected plantations where herbicides were not used or were ineffective, but the hundreds and hundreds of plantations that DNR field staff cruised in 2012 that reveal fully stocked sites with little to no hardwoods at all. I’d go one step further and say we should have the results of these plantation cruises made PUBLIC – because after all, it was done by a government agency with taxpayers dollars. I have walked through these plantations and flown over them repeatedly for over 15 years – from one end of the province to the other. Most hunters and fishermen have also walked these, skidoos through them and ATV’ed through them but the majority of the public have not. I definitely agree that they should see first-hand what the forest regeneration data at DNR also proves – that your plantations are stocked almost ENTIRELY of evergreen trees with less than 10% hardwoods. I’d encourage EVERY SINGLE NB resident to take a drive ……stop at one of the many plantations along our highways in NB –every place they see a nice big Irving sign…. at Petitcodiac, in the Caanan woods, between Moncton and Sackville, around Mount Pleasant, at Boston Brook, outside of Chipman – get out and walk through these stands right along the highway and see for yourself – first-hand - who is being truthful about the effects of herbicide and take a look around to see how much deer food exists in these plantations, and how much deer scat and tracks exist here. Then take a drive through Rothesay and we’ll compare both. I’d say the sooner we can do this the better.
Really, the only point we disagree on is your confusion over deer abundance and where exactly deer in our province live. However, this is likely because I am a deer biologist while you are a fish biologist. Far be it from me to debate fish issues with a fish expert, however, I do believe I can speak to deer biology a little. You continue to mention deer numbers are up one year, then down the next. These short-term fluctuations always occur in deer herds and are definitely due to weather events. Good winters, numbers grow, bad winters, numbers decline – we both agree here. However, we’re not talking about these short term changes, but the LONG term changes and the overall carrying capacity of CROWN land for deer. If, as you purport, your management is so favourable for deer, then when the herd grows, as it has the past 3 years, hunters should be flocking to your managed land….there should be tree stands all over your plantations that support such good habitats for deer. However, we both know the REVERSE is true. Hunters no longer flock to Crown land, but the pressure on private land is intense. Recent media stories further prove that when deer herds grow, they grow in URBAN areas, NOT on Crown land. DNR as well as foresters have used the argument that there is NO DEER on Crown land to justify lowering the amount of Conservation Forest by harvesting in these vacant deer yards. If the herd is growing – and on this ground you say is great for deer – why on earth would anyone agree to removing these deer yards if deer will return shortly???And why is the Dept. of agriculture implemented a new nuisance wildlife compensation program to pay for deer damage to crops? Why is the Rothesay mayor in the media complaining about growing deer numbers here?? I’d say the facts here paint an entirely different picture than you have.
I was encouraged that we were so close in agreement on many of your points. Let’s get together and schedule a time when the public can participate in the topics you raised in your letter. I think it will be a most educational exercise.
If the public – once they are informed of the current state of the forest, where deer live and how herbicide affects the landscape, and once they see ALL pertinent research and walk a few plantations – if they then decide they want to continue on this path – I can honestly say I’m OK with it. However, if the public is NOT willing to give up a public resource (deer& other wildlife) on their publically owned land (Crown land) given the latest research that shows reproductive problems and ecological damage – I can live with also. My intent is NOT to decide this, my only intent is that the public be well informed so they can make a well informed decision on a topic that affects all residents and our wildlife resources. Please do not infer what my intent is without first speaking to me directly.
Lastly, Once we have looked at the research and we realize that it is either poorly done, or that well done research does NOT relate to the NB conditions OR white-tailed deer…..If either of these statements are true – I expect a public apology from you and your company given your slanderous remarks.
Certified Wildlife Biologist
Posted 24 February 2014 - 05:39 PM
EXCELLANT RESPONSE AXMAN!!! Don't let the bastards BULLY you or anyone else in this province. THANK YOU for sticking up for the people of this province.
Posted 24 February 2014 - 07:16 PM
Great work, it's obvious the media campaign to stop herbicide spraying is working and has gotten the attention of JDI and the government.
Posted 24 February 2014 - 08:22 PM
Good to see Mr Cumberland maintaining the high road and not specifically targeting a certain company / person. Thats a good angle.
Its about herbicide use on crown land and its effects...not WHO is using them.
Hopefully the other folks that were at the press conference table last week start stepping up vocally as well ( Conservation Council, Outfitters, NBWF, etc). ?? Perhaps they have and I haven't noticed it in the news. If so my apologies.
Refreshing to see some valid public pressure put on DNR and government.
Posted 24 February 2014 - 09:17 PM
Thanks Rod, for having the knowlege and the guts to speak out, and represent the many of us who agree with and support you, and the many more of us who are oblivious to what goes on in our forests. Like you said, if everyone really knew what government and Irving were up to, there would likely be outrage. I'm glad that the shades are finally being pulled up. Keep fighting the good fight.
Posted 25 February 2014 - 08:55 AM
Well, I for one am sure happy that you are no longer working for the N.B Bullshit Gvt as a Wildlfe Biologist,(wish you were still there under different circumstances) You must feel good to finally be able to speak your mind !!! You have my upmost respect and support my friend. Hope people / hunters and groups/associations rise to this Golden opportunity that you have provided by getting this in the media .
Good Job and a Big Thank - you for coming forward !!
Posted 25 February 2014 - 09:04 AM
Is there a link to listen to the interview? The one above didn't work.
It aint all about the rack, its about the track.
Marlin 336 .35 Rem.
Remington 7600 .30-06
Savage 340 .30-30
Browning BPR .22 mag.
Posted 25 February 2014 - 09:45 AM
Good on Ya Rod!
Glad to see you trying to get an open discussion on the matter!
Posted 25 February 2014 - 09:57 AM
is there any way to find the email address and mailing address for John Gilbert the fish biologist from irving? Maybe it is time we started standing up beside Rod and start sending letters/emails.
Just a thought
Posted 25 February 2014 - 12:07 PM
Sometimes a picture is worth 10,000 words...
It should be noted it is an area of Nova Scotia and was not sprayed by JDI, but another company using the same glysophate sprays.
This is an aerial photo of my hunting grounds.
The 4 grey cuts in the middle were sprayed in late August of 2012.
The cut north was made in October / November of 2012...the cut to the west was made 8 (?) years ago.
You can see that even the fresh cut is showing signs of rejuvenation (plush and green)...the sprayed cuts are a wasteland. The photo was taken June 22, 2013.
Sorry Mr. Gilbert...If you believe that kind of practice (spraying) is good for wildlife, in any way shape or form, you should request a refund on the degree the university gave you...IMHO.
(Sorry guys...the picture is undersized. I did put it in the gallery, though)
Posted 25 February 2014 - 12:54 PM
Keep up the good work Rod.
With all due respect.......it matters precious little about Rod........he's doing all he can but he's just one man. It matters what the rest of us do. Chop, chop!!
Posted 25 February 2014 - 01:09 PM
Great Job Axeman. Your right, this issue is not about any one of us in particular, it's about ALL of us united moving forward on an issue. Keep the feet to the fire and we will stand behind you 100%.
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