Ideas to Improve the Moose Draw

Here's what I think:

1. Use PAL number for application or assign a WIN number like in Alberta that you keep your entire life. You get this when you buy a hunting license and show proof of a hunter's education/gun safety course or grandfathered in from the past - not a medicare number. Gets rid of the non-hunters applying

• Have more Pirority Groups like in Alberta- nobody gets a chance at a tag unless they are in a high priority. This can work for each Zone

• Force the Native hunters to keep track of kill numbers so we can get more tags out to the taxpayers

If the government if worried about the money lost by the draw then put up the draw fee, license fee and give more tags/sell more licences and this would balance out the revenue lost by the non-hunters not putting in for the draw.

I would not mind paying a bit more if I knew my odds of getting picked were better as long as more tags were issued.

Just a heads up, Native hunters are taxpayers to

All good points. Medicare number shouldn't be used, 'cause when I don't get picked on the draw date, I get an annual uncurable sickness that comes over me!

A very simplistic approach to weaning out the non-hunters would be to have a $100 party fee application, hunting party consisting of 4 to 5 people. This would bring the annual application fee up from $9 to more than double, but would filter out unwanted applications. Once a party is drawn for a WMZ, then the party chief could elect to add on to the group of hunters or camarades, so the ones that really enjoy the 3 day autumn rite can participate. Also, instead of a primary and designated hunter, the group would elect two (2) hunters annualy, courteous groups would soon have an annual rotation of hunters so that each member gets his chance to shoot a moose, or at least try.

Typically, an ideal moose hunting party should consist of 4-5 hardcore hunters afield, ie: 2 hunters and 2 experienced callers / trackers. These 2-3 people group would split up within allowed distances and moose hunt would end at first blood.

Always nice to have an additional softcore member or 2 roaming the roads, on the lookout for fresh sign, or simply keeping everything tidy at the cabin / trailer and cooking meals / drinking beer.

A few years back, a friend of mine came over to the camp to say hello, saw a young bull a mile or so from the camp, brought us over there, we called him out and it made for a great end to our hunt.

NB Moose hunting is a deeply rooted tradition in New-Brunswicker families. It comes at a time of year when spirits run high, anticipation is at it's peak, and the lore of the NB woods and the chance to harvest the great Moose and to enjoy the tender meat over the winter is on everybody's agenda.

I sincerely hope that whatever changes brought forth, if any, will be orchestrated in such a fashion that we will be able to keep this great tradition alive, it defines us as NB hunters.

The New-Brunswick Moose (Alces Alces), the true monarch of our great NB forests.

My 2 cents.

Russ14 said:

why should PAL be required? the whole gun registry thing is retarded anyways and from some news of late is possibly on its way out...but there should be a wait after you are drawn but its not going to change here cause the governement likes the money...there are some god systems in other provinces across this great country but it seems NB DNR doesn't want to look at them and model ourselves after the ones that work so well.

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Because for better or worse (mostly worse) the PAL system is what we have to work with right now.
If you need a PAL even to borrow a gun you should need to have one to apply or buy a hunting license
use the "retarded" system to our own good use for once, it has cost us enough

I like the idea of the WIN system they use in Alberta for a # instead of the medicare #
I like the idea of the party system 2 guns 1 moose 4 hunters ...maybe similar to the crown reserve system for salmon?
The Native hunters should definitely report their harvest only as a tool for moose herd managment (dont wanna step into that hornet's nest)

I think we need ways to stop unqualified people from applying and increase the opportunity for young hunters (ie; 16 to 18 yrs)

Hoytman said:

I do not understand? Naive hunters???

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I think it means Native hunters,
but i do agree we need to watch those "NAIVE" hunters LOL

Holy crow - I hope none of you guys ever get elected into politics so you can see some of your ideas actually used.....if so, some of us are in deep S#&t!!

Up the fee? Hold on there guys. These kind of suggestions is what heads us down the road of only the rich and famous applying and hunting a resource that should be there for all of us. Drives me nuts when the government says our licence fee is the same cost as those licences across canada. Anyone ever compare the average annual income of NB'ers compared to those who live in Ontario and Alberta?? Why should our hunting licence cost the same if the average annual income is significnatly less here?

If we upped the fee to 100 dollars for an application, That's going to kill guys like me who love to hunt, but are trying to make a living on one income in a family. Think some of these things through a bit first guys.

Second - we do have a point/pool system. Someone posted this in another thread. We have 3 priority pools. You keep applying and are unsuccessful, you eventually end up in Pool A where the odds of you being drawn is double the pool C. I spoke with two men yesterday - One who had not been drawn since 1961, and the other man had not been drawn in 38 years. Both were drawn and very happy guys.

Applying by hunting party is not a bad idea....if you could convince the hunters of this. It solves a few problems: the cost (at $100) and the number of applicants. However, we all know what happens as soon as you begin this system too - One REAL hunter applies with 3 phony people, and his 3 other hunting buddies do the same thing. increases their odds by 4 fold. One gets drawn, substitute your other buddies for your 3 bogus guys and off you go.

Letting in 16 & 17 year olds? Man - don't get me started. That is a HUGE NO BRAINER! I still think they should be allowed to hunt everything at 12. Moose, deer - everything......And don't start with the..."some kids are too young at 12, mentor system, etc, etc". We hunters are our own worse enemies on this! Do you think the government will implement anything like that without having a load of bells, whistles and hoops to jump through all on their own? Why complicate it right off the bat and discourage any lowering of the age limit? Just about every other North American jurisdiction out there has a lower age limit - WITH NO mentors, limitations, etc. AND THEY DO FINE! kids not capable simply won't do it. Stats show that youth hunters are the safest out there. None of these jurisdictions have big problems with injuries, etc. that everyone always talks about. For crying out loud, just lobby to lower the age to 12 and leave it. (Ok - end of rant).

Comparing the NB system with other systems is a GREAT idea. But compare the NUMBER of Moose, NUMBER of applicants and size of moose herd. For crying out loud guys - Alberta, Ontario and Quebec are 10-50 times the size of NB, with 10-50 times the number of moose, but not 10-50 times the hunters! Demand there is lower, so they CAN get everyone drawn in 5-10 years.
In NB - we have 65,000 AT LEAST (I think they said over 100,000 DIFFERENT applicants apply over 10 years. We have 50,000 deer hunters, most of who are likely moose hunters as well. so divy up 3,500 licences over 50,000 hunters and AT BEST it will take almost 15 years for 50,000 to be drawn. If we don't limit the applications and keep out granny, sally and tom who never held a gun in his life, it will take 30 years. You can devise whatever system you want, 3 year, 10 year wait, whatever.......you CAN'T get around that we have lots of hunters applying for just a few tags.

EVERYONE registering moose - regardless of who you are - is also a no brainer. If you pay taxes, then stick with the stinkin system and register your moose. You register your car don't you? No difference.

Here is what I hope insightful information about our current draw system, and how it applied to our hunting group this year. Draw your own conclusions.

We are a tight group of 10-12 outdoorsman who like to share a moose / bear / deer / fishing camp every year. Most of us have a sibling or 2, and a parent or 2 who love to hunt and religiously apply every year. By RELIGIOUSLY, I mean we don't skip a beat, we always apply, every year. A lot of folks do not apply on a yearly basis and then complain they never get drawn (I know some of you reading this have gone over 20 years without getting drawn, and for those select few, I sympathize). Yet I'm constantly amazed when someone tells me he never got drawn in the last 15 years, I ask him for his medicare # to check his pooling and he / she skipped 4-5 yrs...

Back to the math: 12 guys x avg 3-4 relatives / good hunting buddies = approximately 50 applications

We DO NOT ask John and Mary Doe to apply. All those applying are hunters, have their hunter ed, own a firearm or a bow, etc. I'm merely pointing out here that it doesn't take long to increase the number of applicants to 60,000, which only represents 8% of our total population.

The overall success rate is 1 in 17 applicants, so logic stands to reason that our group should get 3 licences a year....logically speaking.

Last year, we had 2 licences, this year, we have 5.... + a buddy of mine who just called me to see if I could guide him (I know some of you are getting pissed, but it gets worse...read on).

Of those 6 lucky Moose Draw winners, ABSOLUTELY NONE OF THEM were A pool, 2 were Bs and 4 were Cs.... The 4 Cs, 2 were newcomers to the draw (a youngster and a relocation to the Province), the other 2 having had their licences drawn in the last 8 years...

This is why I would favorably see a hunting party application (no increased fees; $100 between 5 guys is pocket change).

For the members of our hunting group, this would represent having the opportunity to hunt over 2-3 licences spread out between 15 hunters every odd year or so.

This factual based reply is merely to point out that the system is really flawed, and it needs to undergo major reconstruction.

Case in point, one of the lucky winner this year is my dad, 2 moose tags in his lifetime at the ripe old age of 74, but also 2 in the last 4 years...where's the fairness in that?

I rest my case.

I understand the concept of what is being done but to me, each pool is growing in size every year and even though Pool A has more licenses taken from it, the pool is growing larger and larger every year.

That being said, I don't know what the government will do to change the current draw pracices, if at all as this is a major revenue stream for them. Call in fees, moose license and second shooter permits is a revenue stream of upwards of or over a million dollars. Very easy money and guaranteed every year.

One thing I would like to see is a deadline set for purchasing your moose license. As it stands, you can purchase it right up to the day of the hunt or into it, If I am not mistaken. In order to pick up your crown reserve fishing time, you have a certain date to do so by. Why not moose? You can eliminate the anti's who purposely enter to eliminate the legit hunter. I think a month, month and a half after the original draw is sufficient.

With left over licenses, throw back into the draw, free of charge, to the zone that they were drawn from and pick the remainder. I am sure alot of people would be quite happy to get a late gift like that, me included!

As is stands now, there are some licenses not purchased for whatever reasons and in my opinion should be made available to those who weren't.

Just my two cents and ramblings.