New Brunswick Hunting Forum banner
1 - 20 of 49 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
797 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hey, i have a couple friends i thought are pretty gun smart and i asked them both a question the other day and had two total opposite answers from them.I asked them what would you buy the semi or bolt?One answered the BOLT and i asked why and he said the accuracy is so much better.The other fella said you pic what fits you and your hunting situations the best.I told him about what the other fella said about the accuracy and that a semi looses 30 % of its velocity when fired, he told me that that guy no's nothing and it dosen't lose velocity because its a semi.
My question is this -how much if any velocity does a semi loose over a bolt rifle???
And the 150 gr Ballistic silvertip in 300 WSM is supposed to be a 3300 FPS bullet, if i buy this Win SXR with a 24" barrel or the Browning Short trac with a 23" barrel what will the bullet velocity be?????
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
328 Posts
Hey there Ridge Runner, I asked the same question to a guy who has been a guide for 30 years now, and his response to me was "Do ya want to hit what your shooting at", followed by You need to get something which is right for you but he recommended to stay with the bolt action.I know its not the answer to your end question but just sharing an opinion that I found, cause I was looking at the Browning long track, they are nice.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
53 Posts
As some have said go with what suits your needs. For me semi have been a mainstay.A semi will need a little more service.Arguing which is best is alot like trucks and hockey. I have seen much game taken with the REM 740,742 and 7400.The fast loading of the clip into the rifle makes it #1. As for how well they shoot as for all rifles; you need to find the best bullet"load". And for lose of power, the 742 take about 100ft-lbs to operate the action,that's not much to worry about.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,610 Posts
I'm no gun guy but I would think only if the barrel was shorter on the semi, which it sometimes is if it is something like the Ruger Mini 14 or some such would the bullet slow down faster. The accuarcy is better in most bolts but at normal hunting distances I don't think most shooter would be able to tell the difference. I had a mini 14 and the follow up shots were faster as the target acquisition was quicker due to less movement with chambering the next rounds. Reliability on picking up or missing a round might be an issue with some semi's but I never had it jam or miss a round so can't say if it is an issue in other semis.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
565 Posts
Your first shot is always your best shot and guys that say they want the ability for a quick follow up that the semi gives them leaves me wondering a little bit. Like somebody said before, you can work a bolt pretty damn quick when the heat is on. A bolt is more accurate,but like somebody else said, at hunting distances its really not a factor, longer barrels equal more velocity and accuracy up to the point of diminishing returns but again Mr Big Rack can't tell if that bullet was going 2400 fps or 2700 fps, either one stings a little.
Bolt is less care and maintenance and I think that gives it the edge, especially in cold weather but theres thousands of duck hunters out there on the cold wet marsh that have no issues with the semi's...what it comes down to is what feels good to you, and what gives you confidence cause in the end confidence in what you are carrying is often the only thing that matters when the Big Fella steps out.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,285 Posts
I asked them what would you buy the semi or bolt?
Bolt Actions Hands Down(For alot of reasons)
Accuracy,Function,Low Maintenace,Re-sale Value, ect,ect,ect!
I'm not claiming to be no dam expert here, But thats common sense Ca'mon!!

IMO Pal, I would stay clear of the Winny Semi...
And go for a nice bolt gun, which ever one tickles your fancy!!

And your buddy that things the Semi's are the best on the market,
Tell him to give his head a shake!!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
50 Posts
It's all about what your looking for. Are you looking for precision, are you looking to shoot at 100-150 yards at a big enough target, or do you want a chance at 200-300yds or maybe more. Bolt action is precision, your gonna get groups and tight ones. Semi your gonna get groups, but not tight. Now don't get me wrong, you might find a semi with a descent group, but it's mostly not the case. I once had a lever(the next best thing after a bolt), it gave me a descent groupes(would always give me 3" or better), but that one day that we were driving the wood roads and the biggest buck that I ever seen walked out(you only see this happen to you once or twice in a life time), your 3" group now at 350yds, is all over. So I missed him. Let me tell you, now I have a A-bolt browning 300 Win Mag, and it shot very well out of the box, but I knew I could do better. Got the stock beaded, found a load for it and now I shoot at 200 meters in the bulls and the 3 holes are touching. I also got it set up to shoot up to 600 meters. I had a mini 14, great gun, super fun at the range. Group wasn't great, wanted something precis, traded the mini 14 in on a eclipse 1000 A-bolt in a 22-250. Best move I ever did, that thing out of the box with store bought loads, shoot 3 shots in a dime at 100yds. To me precision is what I was looking for, so bolt action(or even a break action single shot "Tom. Firearm" would be better)is what you want. Lever is your next best thing, pretty tight chamber, a little faster to pump another bullet in. Pump action is again about the same as lever. And your semi is the last one on the list. Ask a gun smith what he thinks of semi, you don't see to many sniper rifles in semi. Lets give out this example:I have a 300 mag in bolt, you have the same in semi. We both see a deer, we shoot, we both loose sight of the target for a split second because of the recoil, while I loose sight I bolt another one in and you find your target again. So you might of found your target 1 sec before me, now were ready to shoot again, thats if yours didn't jam up(and it happens, it happen to my buddy at moose season). Just a little example, you don't gain mutch in speed, but you do gain in precision with a bolt.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
317 Posts
The BAR and SXR are gas operated semi autos and it will rob some pressure to operate the gas system, and less gas pressure will almost always lead to lower velocity, no where near 30% though more like 3-4% if I had to guess. The barrel length will also play a factor in velocity but not any great amount between a 23 and 24" barrel aprox 30fps imo (everything else being equal). Another factor in semi vs bolt gun velocity will be the chamber tolerances, the tighter the chamber usually always = higher pressure = higher velocitys. The majority of bolt action rifles in the same price range as the listed semis will have a bit tighter chamber dimensions than a semi since the semi needs a bit looser fit to function reliably. Most factory hunting rifles will not meet the ammo boxes listed velocitys or reloading manuel velocities due to the hunting rifles having a looser chamber than the ammo facory test barrel and also usually a shorter barrel length than the test barrel. Barrel length being equal between the average bolt and semi I am guessing the semi would be losing 100-150 fps in velocity compared to the bolt gun . Again everything else being equal the bolt action rifle is capable of a higher level of accuracy than the semi, but all bolts and semis are still capable of a higher level of accuracy than the user is, for practical hunting ranges the difference in accuracy and velocity between a bolt or semi should not make the difference in success or failure if you do your part. A bolt is also a far stronger action and far less prone to jamming.I would vote for a bolt because of all the advantages even if they arent huge they are still advantages.

I am guessing that if the ammo manufacturer claims 3300fps with a certain load the average bolt gun would deliver around 3200fps and the average semi would deliver around 3100-3050fps.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
925 Posts
All I can say Bud is PUMP. You know how fast these badies shoot and how reliable they are.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
18 Posts
It used to be that guys chose semi's because they shot left handed.Nowaday there is a wide selection of lefty bolt actions available and IMHO no reason to by a semi.Despite what anyone might tell you,semi's are not as accurate as a good bolt action,they are prone to jamming problems and generally too heavy for a carry gun!I own several centerfire rifles and one of them is a semi .30-06 that sees little to no use.If it wasn't for the fact that my dad gave it to me,i'd of gotten rid of it long ago.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,285 Posts
All I can say Bud is PUMP. You know how fast these badies shoot and how reliable they are.
I Couldnt Agree With You More Pal!!
But The Original Posted Stated Bolt Or Semi
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
83 Posts
It used to be that guys chose semi's because they shot left handed.Nowaday there is a wide selection of lefty bolt actions available and IMHO no reason to by a semi.Despite what anyone might tell you,semi's are not as accurate as a good bolt action,they are prone to jamming problems and generally too heavy for a carry gun!I own several centerfire rifles and one of them is a semi .30-06 that sees little to no use.If it wasn't for the fact that my dad gave it to me,i'd of gotten rid of it long ago.
Bolt hands down. Semi's for the most part are good for spraying lead.Bolt is more accurate PERIOD.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
797 Posts
Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Thanks alot, all good reads and info.I know the bolt is surely the best choice overall and i'm also sure alot of you are open country hunters.I'm not.. i hunt the woods and have shot pretty much all my deer in them.
This is all truth my first deer at 18 i hit in the guts and found three days later after shooting over 200 yards from the open door of a truck across an open field???learned a little since then..
Since that deer i have shot 10 bucks and 1 doe with my longest shot at my biggest buck to date in 2006 being about 75-80 yards and all the others where within 50-60 yards so the accuracy thing really isn't an issue.
At this distance i always have a good one in them and though i have trained myself to follow up until they are down, i know they are going down, or until i run out of bullets.LOL I made a couple mistakes in my early years and watched two monsters run away thinking i had hit them and never so now i keep shooting till i cant no more.
I think the semi are enjoyable to shoot and it gives me a good feeling knowing that i dont have to reach up for a bolt to get that second shot out of the gun, and trust me i know that you can shoot a bolt nearly as fast becuase i;ve done it but it is harder to keep on the target for sure..
Still havn't decided and thanks for the great insights....Kev
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
797 Posts
Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Oh another thing,, i dont really matter what i buy because i have this habit of selling it whithin two years of buying it anyways usuallly loosin a few hundred bucks?? Ask anyone who knows me its a fact LOL.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
18 Posts
Thanks alot, all good reads and info.I know the bolt is surely the best choice overall and i'm also sure alot of you are open country hunters.I'm not.. i hunt the woods and have shot pretty much all my deer in them.
This is all truth my first deer at 18 i hit in the guts and found three days later after shooting over 200 yards from the open door of a truck across an open field???learned a little since then..
Since that deer i have shot 10 bucks and 1 doe with my longest shot at my biggest buck to date in 2006 being about 75-80 yards and all the others where within 50-60 yards so the accuracy thing really isn't an issue.
At this distance i always have a good one in them and though i have trained myself to follow up until they are down, i know they are going down, or until i run out of bullets.LOL I made a couple mistakes in my early years and watched two monsters run away thinking i had hit them and never so now i keep shooting till i cant no more.
I think the semi are enjoyable to shoot and it gives me a good feeling knowing that i dont have to reach up for a bolt to get that second shot out of the gun, and trust me i know that you can shoot a bolt nearly as fast becuase i;ve done it but it is harder to keep on the target for sure..
Still havn't decided and thanks for the great insights....Kev
Sounds like you need a good compromise between the two.A pump remington will give you decent accuracy but is a bit heavy.Why not a lever action?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,285 Posts
Oh another thing,, i dont really matter what i buy because i have this habit of selling it whithin two years of buying it anyways usuallly loosin a few hundred bucks?? Ask anyone who knows me its a fact LOL.
Glad to see your doing your part to Pickup The Economy Ca'mon!!
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
2,759 Posts
Bolts are, by design, a more accurate rifle (though ive seen some that were crap and needed work to be even close to acceptable)

As for velocity loss, would be to little to even worry about IMO.

I use an older Browning BAR in 300win mag.
no accuracy issues at all, easy shooting and quick follow up if needed.

trick with the BAR is all in the tightness of the fore stock screw.

Just make sure you clean the gas system once a year.

A little heavy, has 24in barrel, but balances well.

even reloads cycle fine.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
50 Posts
I noticed that you mentioned 300wsm in that first post. Was this the caliber you were thinking of going in. If your hunting in the woods a lot and a lot of your shots are shorter than 100yds, this is way too mutch gun. I know everybody buying the 300 and the 7mm Mag, I did the same. But I modified mine to shoot 600 meters, and thats what there for(long range calibers). It's my primary gun that I use the most, but I'm accualy looking to buy a smaller caliber(308, 270, maybe30-06 "still a little big"), because in the woods or out of the tree stand there perfect. And now I'll tell you why, this appened to me a couple of times and also heard the rumor of it. Few years ago shot a 7 pointer with my 300 win mag, only went about 50 yds in the woods(not thick woods) and was able to find him. But noticed that ther wasn't any blood trail (just a little hair were I shot him). This year the same thing appened again, shot one at about 100yds in a choping about 30 min before dark. It jummed up in the air and took of like a rocket. We went looking for him, now it's dark out, he ran into the woods(were it was thick). Were looking for blood, for hair, anything, Nothing! So now what comes next, the boys at the camp "Ha, Ha, you mist it!". I didn't feel I mist it, So to make a long story short, I found him the next morning. He had ran about 25yds in the chop. and 25 yds in the woods. NO blood anywere, and one chunck of hair about 5yds from him. When I skind him, one pin hole at the heart-lung area and one small hole in behind the ribs on the other side(he was turned a little). But inside "unreal", lost the hole front shoulder area. My buddy told me the same thing,7mm mag and 2 pin holes. It just makes it hard to track them. Now don't get me wrong, you can shoot them in the neck or spine, But if your wanting to mount the head, what do you do. These mag are very powerfull, and if they don't hit anything solide, te'll blow right trought. Deer are not rino's, I'm keeping my 300 as a long range gun, but I'm going back to a 270 or so for the tree stand.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
102 Posts
"These mag are very powerfull, and if they don't hit anything solide, te'll blow right trought"

are you saying that the bullet is going so fast it does not have time to expand??.
 
1 - 20 of 49 Posts
Top