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So I'm calling this fella Willie,as in Willie Survive/hope he mad'er thru the winter and put on another 10-15" of bone?
Got a bit of history with him,sitting on a cutline watching a doe and lil one,looking left when I shoulda been looking right,DOH!Turned my head just in time to see him taking the last cpl steps across a 30m wide pipeline before he dissapeared.At least I kinda think now it's the same buck,but at the time Ida swore he was 160+ and bigger bodied,so maybe I seen his father......or more likely explanation is they ALWAYS look bigger when they're getting away,lol. :D
I sat 100m from this cam location on Nov.23 from mid-morn til dark-thirty,last day of my 12 day deer vacation.....of course he strolled by on 24th....arrrrgggg
Anyhow,I'm thinkn 140sum last year,maybe he goes mid-high 150s this year?Looks to be fairly young/middle-aged body to me,maybe 3.5?Thoughts?

0079E7F0-A5B4-40F6-9E90-CD981E20E771_zps

37D47FB9-BCB3-41FC-AB22-315036306687_zps

....and the body shot

1C81B667-947D-4A08-A3F1-7DDCC2441E40_zps

Finally checked this cam since setting it mid-Nov last year(4.5hr drive from home each way),and super thrilled to find that my other cam on a nearby property was stolen...F%€#!!!Got a cpl more bucks on this one last week Nov though,a young 6pt and an up n coming 3yo 8pt,lotsa does and tons of moose pics thru the winter.
Shout out for Stealth Cam,8xAA batts lasted 8+ months from mid-Nov til end of July.Set on 6 pic burst per event,610 trigger events,3660 pics!!
Unfortunately,since around early May,most of the "events" and over 2000 pics are of tall grass swaying in the wind,lol. :p
 

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I'm going to start the debate here cause its a fun thing to do, now I'm no scoring expert but I'd have to think that buck is not close to 140 yet, there is some length to the tines but not outstanding and g-4s are short. the main beams are barely outside his ears with no real mass to them, I would agree though that he does appear to be fairly young with some growing left to do and he will be better this year. He's a nice deer but I think 140 is a real stretch, my opinion...and begin.
 

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Well guys,I'd beg to differ,I put him at pretty damn handy 140gross give or take a cpl inches either way according to my calculations using ear length,eye circumference,and eye to nose length for comparison.
Granted he's young yet(3.5) and weak on mass,but good tines and beams that curl in.Hard to say the spread from that angle,but I'd give him 16 at least?
It doesn't take a whole lotta antler to make 140 really,and I've come up with my own "7/20" method of quickly judging a 140 min over the years.....er at least I think I came up with it on my own,so far as it's not something I've ever read about?In a nutshell,there's 7 measurements that have to score 20" to make a typical 5x5 a 140+.
Mass x2....most mature 5x5 bucks(4.5yo+) will score an avg. of 5" or more x4 per side,or 20" +/- x2.
4x4s don't score so well on mass generally,even a real cranker gets gipped on the H4s usually.
Beams x2...20" mains +/- x2
Tines....20" +/- x2
Inside spread....20"
So if you look at a buck in the field,and think in terms of 20s all around,you can determine pdq if he makes 140 or not.
Mature 5x5 with good mass,score 40.
Good beams 3x longer then ears,or extend forward toward tip of his nose,score 40.
G2s and G3s that are at least as tall as 7" ears...call it 15" min for 2s and 3s,you only need 5" more from brows and G4 combined to score 20+....x2 is 40+.
Inside spread...ear tip to ear tip is app 16" on an alert buck....does he have an extra 2" on both sides...score 20.
Orrrrr....you can use 140 as a baseline,and subtract or add as required?
ie"narrow spread,-4".....heavy thick beams like beer can bases,+8" etc etc.
Sooo....looking at this buck:
Mass is lite,maybe 4.5 bases with 4ish H4s,so 17 per side,call it 34 or -6?
Decent good beams that curl in,using eye to nose tip @8" for comparison,I've got him @22-23" beam on the right...x2=45 or +5
Inside spread,hard to say but looks narrowish...call it 16,or -4?
Good height on G2s and G3s,again using 8" nose to eye measured,I got 17-18",plus 5-6" per side for brows and G4s combined...let's say 23"/side for tines x 2=46 or +6.
So,to meet or exceed that magic 20 number x7 all around,he comes up 3" short x2 on mass,and 4" short on spread,for a -10,but makes up for it with scoring 22s and 23s all around on the beams and tines....or +11.
Add'em up....comes to 141 by my math. ;)
 

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I think you might be a little generous on the length of the beams and really really generous on the length of the tines, no way those g2s go 18". If you are saying those brow tines are 6 inches then the g 2s are not 3 times the length of those brow tines 12 to 14 inches at best. Still a real nice deer but it takes a really good deer to get up in the 140's and generally mass doesn't play a big role anyway as the numbers get smaller the further out you go, a really big deer might have 6 -10 more inches of mass than an average deer. I have small hands if I make a circle with my thumb and forefinger its almost exactly 5 inches. I can touch my thumb to my forefinger on a 5 inch deer but not on anything bigger and this guy is much narrower than that when you get out between g2 and g3 and further. Just my opinion but this is the most fun discussion we've had on here in a while so I'd like some others to weigh in. Where's bchase or some other of the score guru's on here when there's an insolvable discussion.

Really nice pictures though, thanks for that..Really sorry to hear about your camera.
 

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Sorry,I meant the G2s and G3s combined are 17-18"?Id say 8" on the g3,and 9-10" on the g2
And I said the the g4 and g1 (brow tine)combined are 5-6"......I'd call the the g4 2-2.5".and the brows 3-4" max.....so 5-6" total for the g1 and g2,plus 8 plus 9 for the g3/g4?22-23" all in?
The main beams are well over 20",center of eye to nose tip is widely accepted as 8",and the right beam is just shy of 3x eye to nose.
There's a method to my madness....seriously, I don't just throw unsubstantiated guesses out there.
It's quite fun to play these "guess the score" games on the hunt forums,and quite comical at times to see the guesses vary by 20" either side of official measured score.
Not claiming to be a B&C official expert,but my guesses are always within 5" give or take,and often as not within 2"+/-.
Jest sayn....I'd bet big money that he's 136-146(not)....and probly win the pot at 139-143..
 

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I'd say thats about right for the tine length, I'd have given him even a little more on the g2 just for the sake of argument, so tine length total credit around 46"

Main beams I'd guess at about 20 just from dead reckoning so 40 for that

spread credit i'd put at about 16 maybe 18 cause he is not much outside his ears and his ears are laid back a little so give him 18

circumference is 4 measures per side, give him 4" at the base tapering to 2 for the last, 12" aside = 24

46 40 18 24 = 128. Throw in a few deductions or maybe I've underestimated a couple of inches here or there and best I'd get is around 130. Pretty good deer any way you measure him.

Why don't you just go out and shoot him and tell us what he actually measures this year ?
 

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Why don't you just go out and shoot him and tell us what he actually measures this year ?
Well that's the plan,lol......but I'd give the main beams more like 45 based on center of eye to nose tip being 8" for comparison,and no way the H4 is only 2" nor 24" total...I'd concede a 4" avg for 32 total making 138?Remember 8th grade math,where C=3.14xD....not a chance the H4 diameter is <1". ;)
None of it means chit if I can't put my hands on it ,and of course he'll gain a good 15% this fall put'n him mid 150s,more like 169 if he gets away, lol. :D
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Lol...u mean the ol'Hawken??
Haven't hunted with it for 2 years now since watching a legit Booner walk away just outta range in the final 15min of 2012 season,DOH!
......but it's absolutely hammered anything it touched prior to then with 325gr cast boolits. ;)
 
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